DCInc

Re: Exhuast powder coating??

I am pretty sure I know the answer to this question but I have had two customers lately swear it is out there.

Does anyone know of a powder coating design for exhaust pipes/headers that will withstand the temps? I currently spray liquid ceramics but these guys want a powder version!? I had done searches but come up empty....maybe I am missing something??

Carolina Process Control

Re: Exhuast powder coating??

I've heard of High Temp Powders for BBQ Grills and such - not sure if I've ever heard of this being used in the Auto Restoration Biz.  Good Question.

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DustinGebhardt

Re: Exhuast powder coating??

Hmmm,  I know of a shop in Huntington Beach, CA that does the powdercoating for many of the hot rod shows  you see on TV.  They do exhaust work, too.  I don't have their contact info, but look up Specialized Coatings.  I'm not sure what they use, or if they'd want to share their info with you, but it may be worth a shot.

-Dustin Gebhardt, CEF

Advanced Manufacturing/Finishing Engineer

Moen

Sanford, NC

Southern Metal Finishing

Re: Exhuast powder coating??

I know those guys - you can find them on the web at www.specializedcoatings.com
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non-stick

Re: Exhuast powder coating??

It's the silicone impregnated powders that the guy is talking about. I get it requested all the time and do it quite often. Just be careful on the silver based stuff. It's not as "non-yellowing" as they say it should be. The blacks are pretty nice, though.

As much as I hate the fruitcakes over at Caswell Plating, you can probably get a small qty. there to play with ( 2 lbs will do big block chevy headers).

Regards,

Russ (aka: non-stick)
Vitekres.com
trgcoating.com

DCInc

Re: Exhuast powder coating??

Is caswell the makers of it??? Who do you buy it from?

Specialized told me theirs was a liquid not a powder.

non-stick

Re: Exhuast powder coating??

Plating Kits Electroplating Kits Aluminum Anodizing Kits Powder Coating Systems Metal Polishing And Buffing Supplies - Caswell Inc. is the place that has hobbyist size qty. of the material we're talking about. 2 Pounds should be sufficient for what you are doing. I wouldn't go getting a larger box from the Mfr. ( I think HB Fuller/ Rohm & Haas has the stuff but I'm not 100% certain of that. Feel free to e-mail/call me and I'll get you my supplier if you want) until you have played with it for a while. For what it is, it's neat stuff.

Regards,

Russ

Vitek Coatings Home
racker@vitekres.com
TRG Coating
trgcoating@gmail.com

Southern Metal Finishing

Re: Exhuast powder coating??

I just remembered - Protech Powder Coatings in Canada has a good reputation for High Temp powder.

non-stick

Re: Exhuast powder coating??

I'll second that company. I've used them for years and they have a habit of delivering consistent product. I've no clue if you were a small or large business though. Hence my suggestion to Caswell or Columbia Coatings even for the high temp silicone powders. Some of the larger suppliers won't let any more than 8 oz. of sample go out anymore ( long gone are the days of 3-4 Lb samples unfortunately,lol ). To play around with or for an isolated instance at customer request, I still stand by the hobbyist suppliers before you mess with the industrial type. If not for the fact that sales people won't be bugging you every 3 days alone isn't enough *rolls eyes*

I think they call it Heliocoat line or something whiz-bang like that now, no?

DCInc

Re: Exhuast powder coating??

OK now I see the problem. The Heliocoat product is only good to 900 degrees. While this will work for mufflers and the pipes a good distance away from the head it will not work for the headers themselves. I have measured the external temp on my headers at 500 degrees at idle! That means at WOT the temps reach the neighborhood of 1200-1500 degrees and in some turbos 1800+ under boost. The pipes will actually glow red hot in some applications.

Thanks for all the help guys it really cleared up what they were talking about.

non-stick

Re: Exhuast powder coating??

If you're doing anything near the "turbo" range of heat, I wouldn't trust any powder on the planet. That's just me though. For straight headers I've never had anybody complain. Once the powder is cured, it's cured.

The only coating I'd even consider is in the Whitford line ( Manufacturer of the world's largest line of fluoropolymer coatings - Whitford Worldwide ) for extreme heat applications. They make some fantastic stuff.

DCInc

Re: Exhuast powder coating??

Welcome to Techline Coatings

These are the coatings I use and have been very pleased with them. (all liquid ceramic) The black satin has been on my turbo exhaust housing for 6 years and has never rusted or flaked.

My only concern with a powder is the overbake stability. If it cures at 400 what is going to happen long term if you keep heating to 1200. I know it crosslinks and changes the properties but without some kind of ceramic component I just have a hard time with believing the pigments will last...but I may just give it a try on a personal set.....thanks again for the info. Much appreciated!

non-stick

Re: Exhuast powder coating??

One doesn't need a ceramic to ensure it being tough or resilient in this instance. Does a brick stop being a brick after it's been in place a few years? Of course not. It's permanently in its' place as being a brick. The same happens with crosslinked thermoset plastic compounds. Once traveled to where they have to go ( cured ) there is no going back. The only way back is forward via destruction. Don't let the fact that they are silicone impregnated fool you. It's a pretty tough compound.

mrcoating

Re: Exhuast powder coating??

Check with Forrest Paints the make a powder up to 1200deg black and grey

Paul Fisher

Re: Exhuast powder coating??

I hear that these "high temp" coatings never really work the way you want them to.

What temperatures exactly are we talking about - I see that one coating here in this thread is rated to 1200F, and DC Inc recently stated some turbos go over 1800F - that seems like it could be a problem.... are there coatings that go over 1800F, or would your best bet to just have them plated with  or something like a high temp Electroless Nickel?



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Travis Stirewalt

Re: Exhuast powder coating??

It is my understanding of this high temp silicone technology that there are a few issues.

1. The powders are rated anywhere from 800 deg F to around 1200 deg F.
2. The powders are typically utilized in the BBQ grill market.

A few things to consider. When even these powders are brought to the high end temps, the technology is pushed to the limits. When it is at the limits, the powder begins to break down thus shortening the life of the powder system. Not to mention the fact that most of the coaters use phosphate pretreatment systems and at these high temps, the phosphate coating loses its functionality.

One considerations also is that these powders are typically poor performing from a UV perspective. This means that you will get fading and breakdown of coating over exterior exposures.

There are two heat exposure situations. Long term and flash. In long term exposures, alot of damage can occur. Bubbled up surfaces and overall breakdown. Flash is when the coating is quickly heated and then cooled down immediately. This is often what we see with a show bike or a custom car that is trailered to events for show only. They are fired up quickly for show and then they sit most of their life in shows etc.

Some of the highest end bike builders in the country will swear that ceramic coating is the only way to go.

One more bit of info...due to the heat....powder mfg are very limited to the pigments (colors) used in the powders. That is why you are limited to more darker systems (dark green, brown, black, some silver etc).

Hope this helps a little.

Travis Stirewalt
TIGER Drylac

Travis Stirewalt, CSI, NASF
Senior Sales Manager, Eastern US
TIGER Drylac USA Powder Coatings
www.tiger-coatings.com

andeehunt

Re: Exhuast powder coating??


DCInc wrote:

Does anyone know of a powder coating design for exhaust pipes/headers that will withstand the temps?



I might be able to address you an exact place if I know where you belong from? I have got good sources over the the country so if you still need something the same, let me know where you are located.

changmingchem

Re: Exhuast powder coating??

The silicone based powder coating is OK, we have this type of powders and must cheaper than ur market. One thing you must know that, if you need a very high temperature resistant, then you have very few choice about color. They are: black, gray, metallic gray, our powders can resist a temperature of 300--600 ℃.


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One of the earliest and biggest manufacturer of powder coatings and the raw materials in China. Email: changmingchem@gmail.com